Gary McNees wrote:

> v
>
> "Bob Felts" wrote in message
> news:327B5F0F-AF97-6FEF-4D2E-8CFDE981E59A@srcbs.org...
>
> > Gary McNees wrote:
> >
> > > "Bob Felts" wrote in message
> > > news:172.29.21.05.072083000@srcbs.org...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Gary McNees wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > "Bart Goddard" wrote in message
> > > > > news:153.23.08.05.122259000@srcbs.org...
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > gkmcnees@comcast.net wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Calvinists claim that man is not saved "against his will." But
> > > > > > > the procedure of God regenerating them without their will is
> > > > > > > like putting one to sleep,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > No, it's just the opposite. It's like waking someone up. They
> > > > > > have expressed no will to either remain asleep nor to wake.
> > > > > > They're _asleep_; they don't have a will. God wakes them up,
> > > > > > just like He called Lazarus out of the tomb.
> > > > >
> > > > > Nonsense.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > That's a resounding rebuttal -- and it accurately describes that
> > > > which has happened to so many of us. Read C. S. Lewis if you don't
> > > > believe me or Bart. Do you have anything other scoffing to back up
> > > > your objection?
> > >
> > > Yes. All of scripture teaches that salvation and life from God comes
> > > THROUGH faith.
> >
> > Same topic, different thread...
> >
> > So where does faith come from? Where is it found within the
> > unregenerate?
>
> Bob, I found the following quote from Buswell to be valuable on this
> subject. He seems to be a "moderate" Calvinist, like Geisler.
>
> "The plan of salvation is not symmetrical.

Suppose this is true. It doesn't explain where the asymmetry lies. The
Calvinist will put the "asymmetry" on/in/with God ("He has mercy on whom
He has mercy ... it depends not on human will or effort, but on God who
shows mercy.") The non-Calvinist will put the asymmetry within man. So
this statement doesn't solve anything. It's simply another variation on
the ancient argument.

> Those who are lost are lost "because" they have resisted the grace of God
> in Christ (John 3:18).

John 3:18 doesn't say this. It only talks about the result of belief;
it doesn't address how the unbelieving come to faith or why the
unbelieving stay in unbelief.

> Those who are saved are saved because God saves them, and for no other
> reason (Romans 9:16)." Buswell, systematic Theology, 2:145.
>

So the conclusion is that God overcomes the resistance of the l