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Bob Felts wrote:
> Gary McNees wrote:
>
>
>>Bob Felts wrote:
>>
>>>Gary McNees wrote:
>>
>>>>>What you miss is that God's enabling is brought about by a change of
>>>>>nature -- and a different nature results in different decisions.
>>>>
>>>>No this is not what I "miss." This is pure eisegesis. It is based upon
>>>>your theology, not on Scripture, for it contradicts Scripture.
>>>
>>>
>>>Jeremiah disagrees with you: "Can the Ethiopian change his skin or the
>>>leopard its spots? Neither can you do good who are accustomed to doing
>>>evil." [13:23].
>>
>>What you do is the constant ploy of the Calvinist. I have not said that
>>any person can change his nature. God does the changing of our natures.
>>What I said is that man can receive a free gift.
>
>
> How can a nature which is hostile to God and unable to please God
> receive a gift that it desperately does not want?

Ask Cornelius or the woman at the well. Here are two examples of two
unregenerate persons doing just that.

>>>Rom 8:7-8 says the same thing. Man must be changed in
>>>order for man to follow God -- and man cannot effect that change.
>>
>>I agree wholeheartedly. The gift of salvation from God is what changes
>>the man. Man simply receives it by faith in Christ. Why do you insist on
>>disbelieving Christ????
>
>
> I don't disbelieve Christ. I disbelieve you. Look at what you have
> just said:
>
> 1) You agreed that man must be changed in order to follow God.
> 2) You agreed that man cannot change his nature.
> 3) You agreed that the gift of salvation is what changes the man.
>
> Therefore, man cannot believe until he is first changed by God.

Your "logic" is atrocious. That is, it is not there.

>>John 12:36 "While you have the light, believe in the light, that you
>>may become sons of light." You certainly do not believe this, for you
>>insist that one first is regenerated/become a son and THEN one believes,
>>but God says the opposite.
>
>
> Of course I believe this. What I don't believe is your interpretation
> of it. From man's point of view this is what happens. God's point of
> view is different.

As I paraphrased for Bart: The Light is Christ.
Christ is God. Hence, "while you have Christ, believe in Christ, in
order that you may become a child of God."

>>>>Jeremiah 31:3 The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I
>>>>have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness
>>>>have I drawn thee.
>>>
>>>
>>>And who is the object of His love in this passage? It is Israel, aka
>>>the elect.

Or really, all Isr