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>
>
> Stephen M. Adams wrote:
> > wrf3@stablecross.com (Bob Felts) writes:
> > >I notice you didn't answers "lsenders" questions.
> >
> > There is no way to answer a straw-man argument directly. Not without
> > conceding something that we will not concede (because it is not
> true).
> > Namely, that we are 'arminian' which we are categorically not.
> >
> > Since Loren has created an either/or false dilemma, there is no way
> > to answer his question directly. When he's willing to admit that
> > there is a 3rd way, then we can have a fruitful discussion.
> >
>
> It is not a "straw-man" whether you are of the Pelagian form known as
> Arminainism or some other form. And dispite your denial, it is truly
> an either/or dilemma.
>
> Dispute the 5 points made in regards to their being antithetical in
> nature. The only "3rd" way is to produce yet another variant of
> semi-Pelagianism. That is all. Unless you can do better than all the
> books and all the apologetical lectures I have read or listened to, I
> will not accept a "3rd way." You must provide and prove it. Is that
> not the reasoning behind this forum?

Loren, I doubt you will understand it, but Geisler does give another
"way." The reason I doubt that you will understand it is because one
of your fellow Calvinists, White, wrote an entire book trying to refute
Geisler, but to any of us who actually understand this "way" we realize
that White did not even understand the "way" Geisler showed.

There is a reason that you cannot understand. It is because of your
fundamental presuppositions, as I mentioned before, which you poo-pooed.

Your fundamental presuppositions are: 1) voluntarism, A thing is right
because
God says it, rather than God saying a thing because it is right.; 2)
occasionalism;
and 3) determinism. (Theistic)

Until you are willing to admit that just perhaps your entire
presuppositional system
is false to the core, you will not be able to see the truth.

But you should have gotten some clues by now. When it is required that you
mangle Scripture as required by Calvinism to keep the system afloat, you
should
begin to have some doubts as to its truth. Ask yourself why it is necessary
for
you to actually change the meaning of hundreds of verses, change the meaning
so drastically, that the meaning you arrive at is the very opposite of what
any
normal, non-Calvinist would understand the verse to mean?
This is always done by ADDING words to God's word, or taking away words,
or by changing the meaning of words. always to make the verse fit your
preconceived
system, built upon false presuppositions.

I am very familiar wit