Sorry,

I was referring to gpat...@bayou.com Aug 31, 5:15 pm who writes:

Why don't you do like the most of us Christians do, and read scripture
to say what you want it to say? For example, if you don't like the way

Jeremiah 7:22 reads, just read it to say what you want it to say. Use
the same approach to the rest of scripture that you use when you read
Jeremiah 7:22. Problem solved! ;-)






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The Testimony of Origen

Origen was perhaps the greatest shining light of the Alexandrian school
of the early church, the pupil of Clement, and was noted for his
brilliant scholarship. He put together the Hexapla, a combination of
six early translations of the Scriptures, including our modem copy of
the Septuagint. At one point in his career, Origen was demoted and
stripped of all ministerial authority by the bishop of Alexandria, out
of jealousy and a vengeful spirit, but he was still admired and
accepted by the Asian churches. He moved to Caesarea, and completed his
life's work there. Origen lived from A.D. 185 to 254, we are told.

Origen said that "the Father and Son are two substances . . . two
things as to their essence," and that "compared with the Father,
[the Son] is a very small light."

This CLEARLY contradicts the Nicene Trinity. Although Origen did call
Jesus "God" it is clear he was not talking about a co-equal trinity.

". . . so, according to our view, it was the Logos God, and Son of
the God of all things, who spake in Jesus these words, 'I am the way,
the truth, and the life'; and these, 'I am the door'; and these, 'I am
the living bread that came down from heaven'; and other expressions
similar to these. We therefore charge the Jews with not acknowledging
Him to be God, to whom testimony was borne in many passages by the
prophets, to the effect that He was a mighty power, and a God next to
the God and Father of all things. For we assert that it was to Him the
Father gave the command, when in the Mosaic account of the creation He
uttered the words, 'Let there be light,' and 'Let there be a
firmament,' and gave the injunctions with regard to those other
creative acts which were performed; and that to Him also were addressed
the words, 'Let Us make man in Our own image and likeness'; and that
the Logos, when commanded, obeyed all the Father's will" ("Origen
Against Celsus," book 2, chap.9, Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol.4, page 433).

Notice that the Logos is plainly shown to be subordinate to the Father
-under His control and direction -that the Father commanded, and the
Logos carried out His commands. This