Provides daily news and information to Waldo county. Small fee required.

Provides information about members of Congress, State Legislators, cities, towns, law enforcement, schools, media, courts, census bureau, economic, and population estimates. County courthouse located in Belfast.

Elected county officials, codes and ordinances, policies and other data provided by the National Association of Counties.

Past and present county links and information. Provides genealogical resources and vital records.

Information on culture, attractions, real estate, lodging, dining, commerce, boating, marine and aviation.

Gary McNees wrote:

> "Bob Felts" wrote in message
> news:143.07.06.05.942493000@srcbs.org...
> >
> >
> > Gary McNees wrote:
> >
> > [...]
> >
> > >
> > > No. This is NOT voluntarism. This is essentialism. The Calvinist
> > > believes in voluntarism. That is, the Calvinist God could say that
> > > evil is good, and it would then be good.
> >
> > If He says that it's good, then it isn't evil. God is the sole arbiter
> > of what is good and what is evil.
>
> Very funny. God says that men like you do exactly this.

How endearing.

> Isaiah 5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put
> darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and
> sweet for bitter!
>

So, tell me, how do you go from my statement that "God is the sole
arbiter of what is good and evil" to my allegedly saying that "evil is
good, and good is evil"?

> God does not and cannot just say anything at all.

a) Where did I say that He did? Since you've slandered me to this
extent, put up or shut up.
b) Did you notice that you just claimed that God Himself doesn't have
free will?

> God cannot lie. But your god can lie.

Where did I say that?

> And on top of that then define that lying is good.
>

If God _could_ lie, then it would be good. Do you understand the
difference between "could" and "would"?

> > > The God of the Bible cannot say that evil is good, for that would be
> > > against His nature.
> > >
> > > At least, Bob, try to get the definitions of voluntarism and
> > > essentialism correct.
> >
> > Try this thought experiment. Suppose that you woke up one morning and
> > everything had "flipped". Today you find out that God says is good what
> > you had previously thought was evil. Is it good?
>
> This experiment is impossible. We know what a lie is, don't we?

This though experiment isn't impossible, since we have an existence
proof.

And, yes, we know what a lie is. The question is, is it good or evil?
The moral judgmenet is not the same as the act. And you should be able
to reason about the following proposition: "if God _could_ lie, then
that lie would be good".

>
> The problem is that you have already done this "thought experiment," and
> come out believing that the true god can indeed define that evil is good,
> and good evil, since this is the very essence of Calvinism.

The only way you can defend this statement is either:
a) admit you don't know what you're talking about, or
b) admit that you have a standard of good and evil that is independent
of God.