Excellent points, all.

Jesus' clarification of the commandments neatly encompasses and warns
against a lot of what we see our political leaders (yes, even the
so-called
"faith-based" ones) promoting. The whole notion of "if you want
something
badly enough, and you work hard enough for it, you're entitled to it",
which
seems to underscore the American concept of liberty, leaves God out of
the
equation completely. Then, when it's politically advantageous, they get
up in
arms over gay marriage and a Superbowl halftime faux pas, as though one
sin trumps another somehow. How convenient. How unbiblical, though.

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gkmcnees@comcast.net wrote:

>> "Reason" demands that
>> these people are responsible, even though they had no
>> "opportunity" to respond. They were oblivious to their
>> own actions, so there was no free will involved, and
>> yet YOU and I and everyone else thinks they should
>> be flogged.
>
> I don't agree. It was "free will" that the person was engaged
> in talking on the phone, or not stopping for the red light.

You can try that "out" if you like, but it won't work.
A sin was committed (the killing of a pedestrian) which
the person did not intend to do. At no point does the
person say "I'm deciding to run over that person."

He's responsible for talking on a cell phone while driving,
in your system, because that's what he chose to do. But he's
not responsible for murder, because he didn't choose to do it.
In fact, he didn't even know he did it, until after it was done.

Just change the scenerio a bit. A person is driving responsibly,
but has a horrible phobia of wasps. As he approaches an
intersection, a wasp flies into the car. In panic he loses
control of the car and wipes out a guy in the crosswalk.

1. He didn't choose to have the phobia.

2. He didn't choose to have the wasp fly into his car.

3. He didn't choose to let go of the steering wheel and duck
out of the way of the strafing wasp. It was an involuntary
reaction that came from his phobia.

Do you think he's still not responsible for the guy's death?

Bart

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In Mat 7:16 Jesus spoke, "You Shall Know Them By Their Fruits."
He tells us that you can seperate christians from false prophets by
what they do for us, not how they speak to us.

Lutherans believe that christians are not judged by their good works,
but by their fath. Good works should follow naturally by faith.
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