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thedirkhartog@yahoo.com wrote:
> gpatton@bayou.com wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Mark 8:13-21
> >
> > And he left them, and getting into the boat again he departed to the
> > other side.
> > Now they had forgotten to bring bread; and they had only one loaf with
> > them in the boat. And he cautioned them, saying, "Take heed, beware of
> > the leaven of the Pharisees and the leaven of Herod." And they
> > discussed it with one another, saying, "We have no bread."
> > And being aware of it, Jesus said to them, "Why do you discuss the
> > fact that you have no bread? Do you not yet perceive or understand? Are
> > your hearts hardened? Having eyes do you not see, and having ears do
> > you not hear? And do you not remember? When I broke the five loaves
> > for the five thousand, how many baskets full of broken pieces did you
> > take up?"
> > They said to him, "Twelve."
> > "And the seven for the four thousand, how many baskets full of broken
> > pieces did you take up?"
> > And they said to him, "Seven."
> > And he said to them, "Do you not yet understand?"
> >
>
> Of course Jesus didn't really say any of this - you're quoting a
> legend. The ancients' standard operating procedure was to invent
> quotations. The Old Testament's sop was to invent quotations - 'God
> said "Let there be light." '.
>
> "Mark", who never claimed to be Mark, who never claimed to have been
> there for any of this, who never claimed to have known Jesus, followed
> ancient tradition. He needed a quote, he made it up.
>
> You are citing legend.


Mr. Hartog:

Now that we have dialoged a bit, I would like to go back to my original
post and your first response.

Here are a few of my observations;

(1) Your understanding of the word "legend" covers a large number
of stories that I would not refer to as being legends. I think you now
understand that we differ on the proper way to use that word, and that
we will continue to do so.

(2) You and I have different understandings of the origin of "The
Gospel of Mark". And that we will continue to do so.

(3)I don't know why you thought that I was suggesting that I that
those words were what Jesus actually said. When I said, "Jesus
said" I was not suggesting that Jesus spoke either English nor Greek.
Nor did I suggest that the writer of the Gospel heard Jesus speak.
Now, I cannot convince you that I know for sure Jesus did express
certain ideas, but on the other hand, you cannot convince me that you
know for sure that Jesus did not express those views. One reason for
our failings in this matter is that neither one of us were there to
hear Jesus speak those hundred of years ago. So if you are trying to
convince anyo